Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

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Simple question should we stay in the EU or opt out ?

Poll ended at 26 Mar 2016, 18:48

IN
6
50%
OUT
6
50%
 
Total votes : 12

Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby johnh » 17 Apr 2017, 12:09

Don't see what's wrong with the occasional piece of Brexit propaganda. After all, we are treated to Remain propaganda on almost a daily basis by the Guardian and BBC.
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby Sniffer » 17 Apr 2017, 12:57

That wasn't the point of my post though, John.

It's ok to plead "Don't shoot the messenger" if you've been asked/cajoled/forced to pass on a message as you're an innocent go-between. If you've actively sought out an article that you know is likely to antagonise 48% of the electorate then you are not an innocent and should be prepared to face the consequences of your actions.

Not that I am seriously advocating shooting VHTM. At least not this time. ;)
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby White Knight » 17 Apr 2017, 13:19

I thought the article was generally well written and interesting in it's main point, i.e., the pro's and con's of democracy and what the "will of the people" actually means.

"In recent years, a professional elite has exercised a monopoly over political debate, treating public life in the UK as if it was their private affair, from which the ‘Others’ were excluded. The Brexit vote by the revolting masses broke that monopoly and raised the chances of breathing new life into popular democracy."

In the above paragraph the author pointed to the core reason for the vote in favour of Brexit. Aside from the issue of immigration, the people got a rare chance to rise up and give the establishment a bloody nose by voting against whatever the government was asking them to vote for. Hence you get the "Others", i.e., the poor and the working class, in particular, availing of the opportunity to stick a finger in the eye of the "professional elite". The EU and all of it's pro's and con's had less to do with the vote that is now imagined. For the areas and groups that gave the elite/government a kicking in this vote they scored a spectacular own goal. The EU has given them more financial support in accessing education, workers rights, and funding for disadvantaged areas than they would ever has gotten from a national government.

The elite, the well off, the better educated and government representatives are going to be fine no matter what comes down the track now. The same can't be said about the "Others".

As for the constant attacks about the bias of the BBC, people saying this in Britain should get a hold of themselves. Compared to most other countries, the BBC, as a national broadcaster, is a paragon of truth and virtue. Of course it will never be perfect and is only going to be as good as the people working in it, but it remains one of the outstanding organisations set up in Britain in the 20th century, and it is viewed that way by most of the world. It deserves more support and respect that it seems to be getting lately and that is worrying. What would you replace it with?
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby johnh » 17 Apr 2017, 18:01

White Knight, the EU haven't 'given' anything. Like national governments, they don't have any money of their own. It is taxation they receive from member countries. As we are one of the few net contributors, they are returning SOME of our own money.
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby White Knight » 17 Apr 2017, 20:35

You are correct John, but the aim of the EU is to use that money secured from the member states to bring a standard of education, rights for citizens, consumers and workers and as support for areas of disadvantage that many national governments couldn't give a toss about. This is mostly because the people dependent on these supports seldom vote in serious numbers and, as a result carry little political clout. That is the irony of the "ordinary people" rising up for this one vote.

Much the same happened in the US Presidential election.
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby Viduka Hits The Mark » 18 Apr 2017, 06:18

Not that I am seriously advocating shooting VHTM. At least not this time.
I have this chilling vision of you loading up the gun Sniffer with a smile on your face. :D

The reason I put up the article was to highlight the propaganda machine in motion by certain public figures. I wonder if it's the others that people like Gina Miller have in mind when she is using every legal wrangle available to thwart the governments progress?

The BBC daily politics show does a fantastic job in it's coverage of a whole range of political debate (including Brexit).

I'm glad you found the article interesting Johnh & WK.
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby Davycc » 18 Apr 2017, 10:12

And now a general election in June. New thread to discuss http://www.lufctalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&p=127119#p127119
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby Viduka Hits The Mark » 18 Apr 2017, 10:14

Davycc wrote:And now a general election in June. New thread to discuss http://www.lufctalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&p=127119#p127119


:wtf: It really is a morning of surprises. This is really going to test all those Labour strongholds up North.
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby Sniffer » 18 Apr 2017, 13:26

Viduka Hits The Mark wrote:
Not that I am seriously advocating shooting VHTM. At least not this time.

I have this chilling vision of you loading up the gun Sniffer with a smile on your face. :D


Not at all, mate. I'm a pacifist. I'd get someone else to do it. :angel: :lol:
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Re: Brexit - Yes or No? - Poll added

Postby johnh » 18 Apr 2017, 14:27

Sniffer, I thought you were going to say 'I'm a pacifist so I wouldn't have a smile on my face'. :D
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