Ex-Player/Manager Watch

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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby rigger » 26 Oct 2017, 12:27

Viduka Hits The Mark wrote:Cant see a positive way out for the lad i'm sorry to say. If you haven't rooted the problem out by now and i'm sure he will have had plenty of help, then I can't see where he's going to find peace from. It must be horrible the feeling of worthlessness, and with that feeling be prepared to literally throw yourself under the bus.





That's a very negative viewpoint - you can but hope he'll find peace.

The daughter of a good friend of mine committed suicide five years ago last weekend.
She was a lovely girl, full of life and in her second year at university.
I'd known her all her life and she was my friend in her own right - we'd watch French movies together as she was studying the language (and way more fluent than me) and she was also the first person I'd send a new chapter of my book to as I was writing it.
I've not touched the damn thing for two years and actually not written anything more on it since her death.
Hers was caused by schizophrenia. Her father had it too and it's a rare form that takes hold during the late teens or early twenties.

She didn't get the help she needed because the local mental health service in Hampshire is shocking.
Her mother is campaigning to help prevent any repeats in the future, but sometimes she feels like a lone voice howling at the moon.

I think with Clarke it'll be different.
Firstly, he's a celebrity so the authorities themselves will be more likely to do something rather than risk ridicule in the media.
Secondly, his status will ensure that relevant charities will concern themselves with his case in order to highlight mental health for other, less fortunate individuals.
Thirdly, he can go private.

There are plenty of treatments available and I'm sure he won't have exhausted all of them.
For some, cognitive brain therapy can work though it's a long - even life-long - process and something he'll need to do every week, rather like a recovering alcoholic or drug user.
My girlfriend has ADHD and she is currently attending a therapy group for CBT to deal with it. She had been seeing a counsellor but it just didn't suit her as talking about it doesn't really help with ADHD - what you need is something more "active" in nature.
For Clarke, I'm not sure what will work but it sounds like the penny's dropped for his wife and that's an important step.
I loved that phrase she used about her own mental frame of reference.
He's got a network of people that love him and while that didn't work for my friend - and believe me, the aftermath is horrific for her younger brother and her mother, neither of whom will ever get over what happened - it might work for Carlisle.

I sincerely hope so, anyway.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby Otherworld » 26 Oct 2017, 14:08

CBT is cognitive behaviour therapy. I had it a few years ago to treat my PTSD. It helped, a bit. Other ex-Army pals have used it to good effect, but some have found it useless. I guess it depends on the individual, and how open you are to giving it a try.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby rigger » 26 Oct 2017, 14:18

Otherworld wrote:CBT is cognitive behaviour therapy. I had it a few years ago to treat my PTSD. It helped, a bit. Other ex-Army pals have used it to good effect, but some have found it useless. I guess it depends on the individual, and how open you are to giving it a try.


Sorry - that's what I meant, not brain therapy.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby rigger » 26 Oct 2017, 14:20

And your point reinforces what I was saying about Clarke - he needs to find the right thing for him, whether it's therapy, changing his behaviour or surroundings, or something else entirely. It may even be the journey itself that helps him, constantly trying new experiences to help himself get to a place where he feels he can live a stable and meaningful life.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby Viduka Hits The Mark » 26 Oct 2017, 14:52

I hope he finds peace its just a shame for him that he's spent so long looking for it. Sorry to hear about your friend. A lad at work lost his brother last year in similar circumstances. Apparently with him there were no obvious signs, he didn't leave a note and he had just had a young baby daughter to boot. He used to come in the shop every now and then and was a pleasant lad. It's the not knowing why that will haunt the family for the rest of their lives. I suppose it's a very fine line between a cry for help and I someone with real intent.
"Mama always said life was like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get." Forrest Gump.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby Barlow Boy » 26 Oct 2017, 16:06

When we lost our daughter, and I almost lost my Mrs, I was effectively forced into counselling.

“You have seen things Kev, that very experienced doctors and nurses will struggle with” was a favourite phrase of the counsellor as I sat opposite her. I lasted two sessions, before abandoning the whole thing. An utter waste of time and effort on my part and hers, maybe it’s just me, but i found it very difficult to speak with someone who didn’t know me, my wife or have any experience of what I/we were going through.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby Another Northern Soul » 26 Oct 2017, 16:16

Barlow Boy wrote:When we lost our daughter, and I almost lost my Mrs, I was effectively forced into counselling.

“You have seen things Kev, that very experienced doctors and nurses will struggle with” was a favourite phrase of the counsellor as I sat opposite her. I lasted two sessions, before abandoning the whole thing. An utter waste of time and effort on my part and hers, maybe it’s just me, but i found it very difficult to speak with someone who didn’t know me, my wife or have any experience of what I/we were going through.


I think your situation just proves how strong you are/were mate, that you actually might not have needed counselling. I struggled badly with bereavement in recent years and often think I should have sought out counselling but I never did. I wasn't too embarrassed or anything to do it, I just didn't. At one stage I felt so bad I was having chest pain. I got checked out by the docs and my GP prescribed me with anti-depressants. I didn't need them because it became obvious to me that just talking with my doctor was half the 'cure'. But if someone was to ask me if I think I would have benefited from counselling then my answer would still be yes.

Big respect to how some people cope, you and your missus are a v good example even though I barely know you 8-)
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby rigger » 26 Oct 2017, 16:26

Seconded.

I've got a mate who agreed to go to marriage guidance yonks ago but it didn't work for him.

The fact that he counsels other people in his work didn't help because he could just see through the whole thing, knowing the techniques used and everything.

Having said that, I don't think it would've worked on him anyway as he's just not that type of person.

Like I said, it's about finding the right fit for you, isn't it ?
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby Barlow Boy » 26 Oct 2017, 16:42

As you say gents, I think it’s just what fits the person best. There is absolutely no shame whatsoever in seeking help, it just wasn’t for me.

When I lost my mum, I just dusted myself down, and got on with it, but Barlow Junior had to go see someone and found it a huge benefit. Admittedly, he was quite young at the time, but I imagine that’s how older people feel. I did actually give some talks myself to some fellas who were in a similar position to me, they thought it was a huge benefit, as I was actually speaking from experience and not someone who had read what to say/do via a textbook.
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Re: Ex-Player Watch

Postby kk_white » 28 Oct 2017, 16:16

Lost my brother to suicide in March. His inquest was held yesterday.
Like BB, I lasted 2 sessions after we lost Clayton. I'm a very practical person, so I knew what happened and saw no point in asking why.
There's help out there folks, but please guide people to it... Some desperately need it.
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