LUFCTALK

I’m sure people like Kalvin and is it Stix have warned him about joining them and if he still wants to then he’s dead with me.

Guys I would like to put this into perspective for me.

I don't often discuss this never mind on forums. During 20+ years as a serving police officer in NI I lost family, friends and colleagues to terrorist attacks claiming the actions for one reason or another. In 1998 a referendum was held to vote for the Good Friday agreement (not important to many or understood by many and I totally understand why) but I voted NO, I saw it as releasing terrorists on both sides from prison and allowing the same people to have a say in the running of my country. People who I tried to remove from the community, people to this day on both sides who did terrible things. HOW WRONG WAS I TO VOTE NO!

Because of that majority YES vote, contrary to my views, tens if not hundreds of lives have been saved. The youth here now, in the majority, live in peace and don't understand what all the "****" was about, that's a wonderful thing. I was wrong.

What I trying to say is Kev and Chris lost their lives and in my mind those responsible should pay for that, but twenty years of relative peace in a country where two religion REALLY hated each makes a football player joining as team I detest a small issue and I do not mean to belittle the loss of lives. We all need to move on, dislike the fans, yes but hate someone for playing a game ?

Appreciate your words Davycc and how the idea that things are black or white or absolute utterly fail to move people on from emotional and complex situations.

We can move on from this without forgetting Kev and Chris.

I recall a small piece I wrote for LUFCtalk over ten years ago and the final line still rings true:

Reactions at the time still ring true ten years on: "It could have been us," said Leeds supporter Nick Smith to The Independent, five days after the deaths. "It has happened to somebody doing something we all do." And that is the simple truth behind it all. It could have been any of the thousands of Leeds United fans that travelled to Turkey. Speight and Loftus weren't singled out because of who they were, but because of who they supported. This was a tragedy born out of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. The murderous thugs that ran through the street with knives, out for blood, were not after any particular person, just any Leeds United supporter.

That these two men could have been any of us perhaps continues to affect how we view their deaths. Ray Ashworth, a Leeds season-ticket holder for 30 years, captured this feeling, saying at the time, "I feel I have lost two friends," he said. "I have lost my mum and dad and I have the same empty feeling I had then. I cannot explain it. I cannot explain it to my wife. I cannot explain it to myself."

I did not know Chris or Kevin. I don't even know anyone that personally did. But we all know their names, and the one thing that this tragedy continues to tell us: Bill Shankley once quipped that football was much more important than life and death. Chris and Kevin remind us that simply isn't true.

http://www.lufctalk.com/chris-kevin-lee ... emembered/

The Fonz wrote:Think you need to look at it from the individuals position and as others have said Alioski was only 8 on that horrible night.

He is also Macedonian and will have more connections with Turkey than with the UK, he'd probably not heard of Leeds until we got interested in him.
If he can earn some decent money for his eventual retirement can we blame him, would any of us do different in our work fields.

Now Kewell is different he was part of our team back then, not forgiving that one.

Personally like many Leeds fans I'll never go to Turkey as was about at the time, its part of my little protest. I was supposed to be at the match but flight was cancelled on the day so lots of fans didn't get there. I actually part blame Uefa as don't believe the match should have gone ahead.
Doesn't mean I've something against all Turks but it feels right just not to go there.

Still how long do we hate for, it was 20 years ago.
Maybe we shouldn't have signed Koch we had World Wars with the Germans, or dump Meslier as French William put a arrow in Harolds eye.
What about the Falkands should we have allowed Bielsa through the door and wont even start with our Spanish players and that Armada.

Of course all that is stupid you need to look forward and move on, far better to smile than continue with anger of all the things we can't control in history.

So if Alioski moves on it will be with fond memories from me wishing him the best, its still a big if though.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts on the potential move too. I like your comparison of older grievances and it does highlight the failure of absolutism to address complex and emotional situations. Football often fails miserably at this. Maybe one of the reasons we love it so??

Strong rumours that Patrick Van Aalhort is on his way to Galatasaray on a 3 year contract in the summer. If that is confirmed then Alioski won't be joining them.

Bielsa, Orta, and Kinnear, have said " We are only going to bring in players who improve on current squad".
When we sign a quality left back, and not until would I be happy to see Alioski leave.
The defence is playing good as a unit, he's part of that unit.
Dallas is too valuable in other positions to be used as permanent left back.