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[Sovietmule]

But we go back to the basic argument that we can simply print more money and it is as simple as that

These days it's all done via keystrokes but you're right, it comes down to creating money out of nothing.

The limits are the real, physical limits within the economy apart from those there are no real restraints.

I understand it's a different way of thinking about things but what is it about creating money that makes you uncomfortable?

P.s. here's a clip of Ben Bernanke, at the time, chair of the us central bank, explaining how they put $1.5 trilliion into the us economy
https://twitter.com/StephanieKelton/sta ... 9424?s=19

[Davycc]

But we go back to the basic argument that we can simply print more money and it is as simple as that

These days it's all done via keystrokes but you're right, it comes down to creating money out of nothing.

The limits are the real, physical limits within the economy apart from those there are no real restraints.

I understand it's a different way of thinking about things but what is it about creating money that makes you uncomfortable?

P.s. here's a clip of Ben Bernanke, at the time, chair of the us central bank, explaining how they put $1.5 trilliion into the us economy
https://twitter.com/StephanieKelton/sta ... 9424?s=19

So why not have the Government, whoever that may be, issue templates to all citizens who then could print off money as and when needed?

[Sovietmule]

Why do you take my posts so personally?

If you mean disagree with what you say is taking it personally then yes guilty as charged.

The fact is that it was you that made the remark on my post (which was just saying stating facts as I know them) which I said sounded condescending. I never said you were condescending just pointed out how it read to me. I appreciate we can all write things at times that can read in more than one way and assumed that to be the case.

But as you say "Posts" plural are you saying I've some sort of issue with all your posts because if that s the case could you please point out with examples which posts you feel I've taken personally. As I say I disagree with lots of what you say but completely dispute your accusation.

There was another post where you said something like 'way to belittle someone' or something like that when my intention and words were nothing like.

Anyway, we're both adults, let's move on man.

If I did it would have been what I thought with your wording.

But as you brought it up here it is -

If you were around in 2008 then,

FFS an attempt to belittle someone.

How would you think someone in their 60's would read that ?
That is suggesting I'm under 12 or a child at best, you used it when getting no joy with your argument.

But as you say time to leave it.

I don't expect everyone to understand what I'm putting forward or even to take the time to investigate for themselves the rights or wrongs of what I'm saying.

Some get it, some don't, that's life mate. If I can encourage just one person to look into these matters then I'm delighted and consider my efforts worthwhile.

I don't think there's any point in continuing discussions with each other but whenever you put forward your views on public spending you can expect me to challenge them.
I wish you all the best.

[Davycc]

Why do you take my posts so personally?

If you mean disagree with what you say is taking it personally then yes guilty as charged.

The fact is that it was you that made the remark on my post (which was just saying stating facts as I know them) which I said sounded condescending. I never said you were condescending just pointed out how it read to me. I appreciate we can all write things at times that can read in more than one way and assumed that to be the case.

But as you say "Posts" plural are you saying I've some sort of issue with all your posts because if that s the case could you please point out with examples which posts you feel I've taken personally. As I say I disagree with lots of what you say but completely dispute your accusation.

There was another post where you said something like 'way to belittle someone' or something like that when my intention and words were nothing like.

Anyway, we're both adults, let's move on man.

If I did it would have been what I thought with your wording.

But as you brought it up here it is -

If you were around in 2008 then,

FFS an attempt to belittle someone.

How would you think someone in their 60's would read that ?
That is suggesting I'm under 12 or a child at best, you used it when getting no joy with your argument.

But as you say time to leave it.

I don't expect everyone to understand what I'm putting forward or even to take the time to investigate for themselves the rights or wrongs of what I'm saying.

Some get it, some don't, that's life mate. If I can encourage just one person to look into these matters then I'm delighted and consider my efforts worthwhile.

I don't think there's any point in continuing discussions with each other but whenever you put forward your views on public spending you can expect me to challenge them.
I wish you all the best.

And challenge is welcome, as long as we all agree to accept when we think others are wrong

[Sovietmule]

So why not have the Government, whoever that may be, issue templates to all citizens who then could print off money as and when needed?

Technically, anyone can create their own money, getting it accepted is the tricky part. For example, I could start creating sovietmule bucks tomorrow, but how would I get anyone to accept them?

To answer your question though, as it applies to government spending, the creation of currency in any country that has its own currency is controlled by government monopoly, they keep that power for themselves.

[Davycc]

So why not have the Government, whoever that may be, issue templates to all citizens who then could print off money as and when needed?

Technically, anyone can create their own money, getting it accepted is the tricky part. For example, I could start creating sovietmule bucks tomorrow, but how would I get anyone to accept them?

To answer your question though, as it applies to government spending, the creation of currency in any country that has its own currency is controlled by government monopoly, they keep that power for themselves.

ok But you still have not given me an alternative that works.

[Sovietmule]

And challenge is welcome, as long as we all agree to accept when we think others are wrong

I'm simply putting forward an argument and looking forward to accepting and trying to answer any questions in the best and most respectful way I can.

I'm happy to challenge and be challenged. If others simply drop out of the discussion saying I'm wrong but without providing a cogent argument explaining why I'm wrong then what can i do but accept it?

If people don't want to engage in the discussion then that's up to them isn't it.

You don't have to listen or engage but if you do I'll try my best to explain what I'm saying.
All the best.

[Sovietmule]

So why not have the Government, whoever that may be, issue templates to all citizens who then could print off money as and when needed?

Technically, anyone can create their own money, getting it accepted is the tricky part. For example, I could start creating sovietmule bucks tomorrow, but how would I get anyone to accept them?

To answer your question though, as it applies to government spending, the creation of currency in any country that has its own currency is controlled by government monopoly, they keep that power for themselves.

ok But you still have not given me an alternative that works.

I'm struggling to understand what you mean, an alternative to what?

[Davycc]

And challenge is welcome, as long as we all agree to accept when we think others are wrong

I'm simply putting forward an argument and looking forward to accepting and trying to answer any questions in the best and most respectful way I can.

I'm happy to challenge and be challenged. If others simply drop out of the discussion saying I'm wrong but without providing a cogent argument explaining why I'm wrong then what can i do but accept it?

If people don't want to engage in the discussion then that's up to them isn't it.

You don't have to listen or engage but if you do I'll try my best to explain what I'm saying.
All the best.

This is indeed discussion as it's meant to be. I don't think anyone is dropping out of the discussion. I disagree with your views, believe me I'd like to find a better way but each citizen paying towards the general good is my way of thinking. There's an argument that it's not being carried our properly but just printing more money won't work. And we jump on that merry-go-round again.

[Sovietmule]

This is indeed discussion as it's meant to be. I don't think anyone is dropping out of the discussion. I disagree with your views, believe me I'd like to find a better way but each citizen paying towards the general good is my way of thinking. There's an argument that it's not being carried our properly but just printing more money won't work. And we jump on that merry-go-round again.

What I'm talking about is not some 'pie in the sky ' utopia. What I'm describing in terms of government spending is how things actually work, today, now. But I understand the difficulties in accepting this, I had great difficulty myself at first. It's hard to shake off a narrative you've been told for a lifetime.

But I hope you will allow me to ask you some questions now:

1. Why do you think just printing more money (within the parameters I've mentioned) won't work?

2. How can you pay your taxes unless the money was spent into existence by the government first?

I'm not into trying catch people out, these are genuine, honest questions and I'm genuinely interested to see your replies.